Placating the GOP base or protecting the workplace? »
Posted by: deathray 1 year, 1 month ago314 Comments Report this Story
Whether or not the Bush administration's stepped-up immigration raids are a political stunt to soothe angry Republican voters, they still carry a human price tag.
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deathray1 year, 1 month ago
I'm not sure what I think of all this, but I hope to get some decent debate out of it. For all the strong feelings on all the sides of this issue, there is a human cost. This article addresses some of that:
FTA: Government officials says that these operations are designed to pursue employers who knowingly hire undocumented workers, and to "reverse the tolerance of illegal employment and illegal immigration to the United States." But a growing number of critics on both sides of the immigration issue argue otherwise. They view the raids -- which have proven especially costly in terms of taxpayer dollars and human suffering -- as a political maneuver designed primarily to make the administration appear tough on enforcement, in hopes of mollifying Republicans opposed to Bush's recent immigration reform plan.
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GHOSTWHOWALKS1 year, 1 month ago
Don't do the crime, if you can't do the time. In this case and cases like it, speak volumes about the total lack of border security. To bad the Repugs didn't do anything for the years social security and the IRS sent letters telling the employer that half his work force were illegal. What the heck did the illegals think was going to happen. Round them all up, seal the border, and make it easier to allow legal immigration. Stop playing politics and do the job you were hired to do. As for the whining, and crying, too bad.
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insideoutgraphics1 year, 1 month ago
You know what irks me in all of this? It's BS. The US Gov is full of double standards in terms of "illegal labor". The US State Dept, gave a contract to First Kuwaiti General Trading and Contracting ($592-million)to build the worlds largest US Embassy this side of the Universe. They in turn had contracted low wage labor forces from South Asia and the Philippines. The workers thought they were going to work in Kuwait. Their passports were taken and they were put on planes and headed to Baghdad. Made to work under horrendous conditions and our tax dollars pay for this type of coerced labor trade. While in the US, they round them up. The US cannot have it both ways. So I feel this is an attempt by the Bush Adm to gather points from those that forget that we were all immigrants once, both legal and illegal.
The Kuwait issue of US sponsored forced labor camps is being addressed, when will the real truth about forced round ups in this country be addressed.US has double standards
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hueygunner1 year, 1 month ago
My forefathers formed a nation on this continent and called it The United States of America. The question of who is an legal immigrant or illegal immigrant was settled back in 1776. I'm not going to argue if I'm the decendant of an illegal immigrant or legal immigrant because my family has been born in this land for generations and we have paid the price of citizenship many times over the decades during the time this nation has existed.
A nation cannot exist without borders and laws. Both are ignored by the millions of illegal immigrants who flood across our borders.
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jordan111 year, 1 month ago
http://three-cents.blogspot.com/2007/07/privati...
You know, you're right. And we're going to see more and more of this use of 'illegal' immigrants to take our minds off of what the hell is being done in our names in Iraq....and the billions we're being robbed of from no bid contractors. We are in serious need of a decent media.
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KingOfTruth1 year, 1 month ago
insideoutgraphics...while that is a good story, have you brought it up to your congresspersons? They need to get that out in the open....ut if a US company did win the bid on it, it probably would have been Bechtel or Halliburton and Demlibs would be whining about that too.....
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deathray1 year, 1 month ago
I certainly do hold the government of Mexico responsible, along with that of most of Mesoamerica, and a lot of South America.
It's unfortunate that people are stuck in the middle of this, and are being used as political pawns on all sides of the issue.
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insideoutgraphics1 year, 1 month ago
This is wedge issue and it's sad to see how many people took the bait and ran with it, due to their own hatred.I'm sure there are those that view Lou Dobbs as a Saint. After all, he's been so instrumental in keeping the wedge issue alive.
It amazes me how this has become an issue. It's twists and turns and misconceptions.
So if they are illegals, then what were we when we took this country over, slaughtered how many Native Americans, put them on Reservations,kept the slave trade going for how many years.We're not that nice really. When you think back on our history.Railways were built using slave labor,Agriculture was built from slave labor,our garment industry was built on slave labor, etc
Now the year is 2007 and all of the projects completed, we want to create borders. Only when it suits our purpose? Who built our cities? Who poured all that concrete.Who climbed the steel beams and built our buildings.Who dug road ways through our mountains.Who died during that boom?Immigrants
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insideoutgraphics1 year, 1 month ago
Continued. Immigrants, both legal and illegal. And Immigrants that were imported illegally by corporations.But no one said anything then.Why? Because it was cheap labor and corps made money off the sweat of a large number of people that we seem to have forgotten about.Throughout our history, we've used people from other countries to do the work that we either did not know how do, or simply felt we were to good to perform labor jobs.
I'm not proud of our history and I'm not actually proud of where we are going today.We selectively remember our past and project about our future. I think this is so sad. Because so many gave so much and were forced under such hardships, only to be reduced to something like a wedge issue in 2007. Where is our humanity? Did we ever have such a thing to begin with? I think not. And now it's a free for all as we reduce ourselves even further from ever attaining any type of humanity in this society. I'm saddened by the hatred that moves this country.
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choctawdancer1 year, 1 month ago
Let's set the record straight. The vast majority of illegal workers are not working in the Ag business any more. They are working in the factories, the construction industry and lately into the warehouse and logistics. Farmers are screaming that they can't get workers because they are doing jobs that are easier and pay more.
Now for a solution, we enforce the laws on the books, employers are fined(heavily for hiring illegal immigrants.)
We start up a guest worker program administered by the State EDD's. If an employer can show that no American workers are available, they can submitt a job order to the EDD. The EDD will charge the employer for the service, will monitor to see that workers are protected and paid properly. Anyone
desiring to work will register with the EDD, they will be given a green card for that specific job only. When the job is done, they must return to their country of origin. Employers will pay health benefits.
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not2needy1 year, 1 month ago
It's too late to appear tough on enforcing immigration laws.
Bush virtually opened to borders, wanted to let anyone who wanted to come in do so, Congress stopped him! Now he wants to appear tough!!! After wanting to basically give amnesty to illegals, he wants to look tough to disgrunteld republicans. EGAD!
What a joke. I certainly hope that the republicans are too smart to be taken in by this.
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deathray1 year, 1 month ago
I'm wondering what you think of the human cost of the increased incidence of ICE raids on he families of the people being incarcerated and deported.
Are they simply political casualties who don;t matter because they can't vote?
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lvrofwolves1 year, 1 month ago
they are casualties of where they were born, and casualties of not doing or being able to do anything about their conditions in their own country. Casualties here? I do feel for them, but bottom line they chose to do something that is illegal in our country. I do feel they are also being used as politcal pawns, as politicans, regardless of party will find anything possible to use for political gain, but it still remains a fact they are illegal.
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joeblowe1 year, 1 month ago
I note the photo with the article: A woman crying because she has been caught. Boo-hoo. I'm sorry if I sound harsh, but don't criminals often whine when they are apprehended? Blame their crimes on the cops that caught them? This isn't any different. The people being rounded up in these raids KNOW they are breaking the law when they come here. They really shouldn't complain when they must take the consequences. The really horrible thing here: the guy responsible for hiring all these people does NOT go straight to jail. HE is the guy that is ultimately responsible for any misery those people suffer.
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insideoutgraphics1 year, 1 month ago
One must also take into consideration the fact that many families, children , babies, are being detained in large private prisons. It feeds an industry that has very little oversite. Texas has a couple of large detainment centers where people have been locked up in cells. Unable to even contact a lawyer, assuming that they even had rights. Which they don't. This is the other side of the wedge issue that many do not even talk about . When the US Gov. holds infants in a private prison, is the time that we all should be demanding answers. Not re-enforcing the hatred that fuels this issue.
If one wants to talk about immigration, then we must also talk about the fact that families have been separated, very little attention to health care, and no contact with lawyers.
And there are those that just see a we vs them issue? Look at the larger picture and then tell me that the Gov is doing the right thing. For whom? The private prison industry and the industry of hate is all I see.
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not2needy1 year, 1 month ago
So true lvr.
The Bush admin gave the illegals a false sense of security. Bushies neglect in dealing with the illegal immigration problems have led these people to think they were 'home free'.
Now Bush wants to get back into the good graces of his party. He knows how unpopular the republicans are now and he is trying to compensate. Too late, and too cruel. He has no heart or conscience.
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slate1 year, 1 month ago
Maybe Bush got the message that people want something done about 'Illegal' immigration. Though there is no way to toss out that many people, there has to be some way to get people here from other countries and while going through the proper steps to do so, instead of sneaking in and having to lurk in society's shadows. At this point it may be too late to do anything but close the borders and allow those here to assimilate.
As far as Bush doing it as a political maneuver; what do you think politicians do on any topic? The Clinton witch hunt was just that, now the Bush witch hunt is the same thing. Tax cuts or tax increases for a particular group or against one. I'd say that 99.96389% of anything done by any politician is a well calculated thing of self interest.
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deathray1 year, 1 month ago
I can't say I disagree with you on the political front. This would seem to be a response to the failure of the immigration bill; the President is acknowledging the pols that tell him he was on the wrong side of the issue...if only this once. Do you think more people will vote Republican as a result of these actions?
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slate1 year, 1 month ago
BTW, the 'open border' isn't a Republican issue alone,,,,, this has been going on during administraions on both sides,,, let's try to not put all the blame on Bush, though I do blame him for his lack of effort during his time in office on said issue.
I will personally vote for the candidate not party the next election cycle.
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AntiNeoCon1 year, 1 month ago
Like sticking your finger in the dike...all show. Elections coming, we gotta look like we are doing something. The article never said what they did with the people they arrested for being illegal. They think that arresting a few hundred illegals (when we have millions) will do the trick? Good luck Republicans...too little too late.
We have a lot of illegals here too, like everywhere. Its a sad in a way to have to deport them after they have moved here and started a new life. A life better than they ever knew before, but they knew the risks before they came here. Now they are being used as a political ploy to gain votes, I guess anything goes when it comes to getting elected.
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Radiofreeeuropa1 year, 1 month ago
Bush promised the national chamber of commerce (a speech televised on c span) that the flow of affordable labor from south of the border would not be hampered. Who's yer daddy?
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Gecko12671 year, 1 month ago
The vast majority of Americans are overweight because the price of food has been held artificially low because of illegal immigrants supported by both parties...Watch prices go up if ANY party does anything about illegal immigration. The unions need to reach out to the mexicans and help them become citizens and get the support they need to demand a fair wage.
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queenb7271 year, 1 month ago
Yes there is a human element to the story. But how could all of this have been avoided? If people weren't coming here illegaly in the first place. Everything begins and ends with the crime they committed. Saying "it's mean" when it comes to enforcing the law is just not a good enough reason to ignore illegal activity in my opinion.
Everyone is saying that 12 million people can't be deported. This is obviously true. But does that mean we should never bother to enforce immigrations laws again? That's like saying since all thieves can't be caught we shouldn't bother trying. The laws should have been enforced in the first place. Then we wouldn't have to deport so many people.
I may be in the minority as far as liberal opinions go. But that's how I feel on the issue.
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joeblowe1 year, 1 month ago
How is it obviously true that 12 million illegals cannot be deported? If it is made clear to them that they cannot get a job, get free health care, free educations - they will deport themselves.
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queenb7271 year, 1 month ago
Because you can't catch everyone. There's always going to be an employer willing to hire them in the hopes that he/she won't get caught. And so there will always be illegals who will go for those jobs.
Who knows, maybe you're right. But a lot of them have the lifestyle you're describing in Mexico. What would it matter to them if they had a crappy life there or here?
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